*** LOG OPENED: Thu Oct  9 01:00:46 1997
---
Participants:
  HandiBot (disabled@trantor.student.utwente.nl)
  Disabled (disabled@lawgiver.megacity.org)
  DopeHat (khodgdon@ionet.net)
  HelloKit (carlym@u.washington.edu)
  Mooooooo (dse@pacific.net)
  ChanServ (nanook@eskimo.com)
  Deb
  Raven_
  phoenyxx
  Micko
  kb9kyy (kb9kyy@indy.net)
  Mooooooo via Telnet (dse@pacific.net)
---
<Mooooooo> Baby's name is Alex :o) 
<kb9kyy> Excellent!!! i'm gonna send her mail tonight... 
<phoenyxx> me too 
<Mooooooo> cool, im sure she would enjoy that 
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<Micko> good night everyone!!! 
<HelloKit> Where are all the people? 
*** Micko has left irc ( Enh@ncer] v5.0 (if you use mIRC... Enh@nce] it!))
<Raven_> I think I'll go, bbl 
<Mooooooo> i dunno :o( 
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<Mooooooo> hello muffie :o) 
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<HelloKit> Hello muffie :o) 
<phoenyxx> perhaps this topic is intimidating :-) 
<HelloKit> jinx 
<Mooooooo> it was always the most popular 
<muffie> HI 
<HelloKit> This topic usually has the biggest turnout, 
    actually. 
<Mooooooo> how r ya muffie? 
<muffie> ok, need some help with this 
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<Mooooooo> Hi Denise :o) 
<muffie> is there another channel besides romance? 
<HelloKit> Denise :o) 
<Amazin1> hi all 
<HelloKit> muffie: Romance is just tonight's topic. We 
    discuss all kinds of things. 
* Mooooooo dips Denise and gives her tender smoochies! 
<muffie> OH,,,,well OK 
<Amazin1> :) thanks Moo 
<muffie> Where do we all live? I'm in Ca. 
<Mooooooo> Denise, Mimi had her baby 
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<Mooooooo> Im in Northern CA 
<Amazin1> tell her congrats for me!! :) 
* phoenyxx is in San Antonio Tx. 
* HelloKit is in Oregon. 
<Amazin1> Nevada 
<HelloKit> 4Are we all ready to start? 
<kb9kyy> ok, let's try this again...has anybody had any 
    problems with their relationship's PARENTS??? 
<Mooooooo> yeppers :o) 
<phoenyxx> Area 51 is in Nevada. 
<phoenyxx> :-) 
<Amazin1> shhhhh...that's classified 
<kb9kyy> lol 
<muffie> what do we get to do? 
<muffie> I'm a parent, watch out 
<Mooooooo> dunno, thats HelloKit's department :o) 
<kb9kyy> yeah, but does your kid date a disabled person? 
<muffie> No, but his mother is one 
<HelloKit> 4Before we actually get down to business, I 
    just want to make an announcement that you've probably 
    already heard... 
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<kb9kyy> go ahead... 
<Mooooooo> Hi Headake :o) 
<Headake> hey still chatting about the romance? 
<kb9kyy> yup 
<HelloKit> 4Late Monday night, after spending her first 
    entire day without IRC... Mimi had a baby boy. 
<Headake> ok cool!!! 
<Mooooooo> see what happens when you miss a day? 
<kb9kyy> lol 
<Amazin1> haha 
<Mooooooo> Carly is next :oP 
<Headake> did she have withdrawals while in labor? 
<Amazin1> yikes! 
<HelloKit> 4His lungs aren't fully developed and he is 
    currently on a respirator, but they say he is going to be 
    fine. 
<kb9kyy> rofl 
* HelloKit slaps Mooooooo around a bit with a medium-sized 
    guppy. 
<kb9kyy> quit clowning...this log is going to be read by 
    several people... 
<phoenyxx> that's good to hear- I knew he was a month 
    early. 
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<Mooooooo> al2 :o) 
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<kb9kyy> i'll be back later... 
<phoenyxx> hello al2 
<kb9kyy> http://members.tripod.com/gjkd/ <== Sign Guestbook 
    (macro) 
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<HelloKit> 4al2: You missed the announcement! 
* HelloKit repeats herself: 
<al2> ahoy mateys 
<HelloKit> 4Late Monday night, after spending her first 
    entire day without IRC... Mimi had a baby boy. 
<HelloKit> 4His lungs aren't fully developed and he is 
    currently on a respirator, but they say he is going to be 
    fine. 
<Headake> not to be rude, but where is the discussion? 
<HelloKit> We're just getting started, Headake... 
<HelloKit> Had to make the big announcement first :o) 
<Headake> oh! I'm always a day late, and a dollar short! 
    Thought I missed it! 
<Headake> Sorry! 
* Headake feels like a big Dolt! 
<HelloKit> 4And now on to 'Disabilities & Romance'... 
* Headake sorry I can't talk now :) 
* Headake is kidding 
<HelloKit> 4First of all, it's been a while since we've 
    done this and I'm sure there are new people here tonight, 
    so let's all update each other on our current situations... 
    romantically, that is. 
* phoenyxx is currently single. 
* Headake who first? 
* Mooooooo is still single and is avoiding female contact 
    until i move 
* phoenyxx and is not dating anyone either. 
<HelloKit> Just go for it, Headake. 
<phoenyxx> but that is not by choice! :-) 
* Headake is currently very much in love, but at times 
    would like to grab her neck and....sorry! 
* Amazin1 as been dating for 2 months 
<phoenyxx> cool! 
* DopeHat is single 
<Headake> we have been dating for over a year... 
* HelloKit is still with her honey (whom she met online) 
    after more than two years, and they are now looking into 
    getting an apartment together. 
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<Headake> hello dannyc 
<HelloKit> 4Welcome, dannyc... we were just updating each 
    other on our current romantic situations. 
<Mooooooo> hi dannyc :o) 
<phoenyxx> geez my luck sucks like a singularity in space! 
<HelloKit> al2? 
<Headake> phoenyxx don't sweat it! It has taken me 6 years 
    to get here! 
<Headake> 7years...:} 
<al2> i'd rather not say right now 
<dannyc> thanks much first time so, I'll just sit back a 
    while ok? 
<HelloKit> No problem :o) 
<phoenyxx> I know...alot of it is that I've been so busy 
    with classes that it's hard to get out on a social basis. 
<HelloKit> 4Headake: Married, dating? 
<phoenyxx> But I get along fine with women I've met in 
    classes so I know I have a chance later on :-) 
<Mooooooo> cool simon :o) 
<Headake> I have been dating the same person for over a 
    year. Recently moved out of state and into an apartment 
    together. 
<phoenyxx> one good women friend of mine met me after she 
    saw me on TV :-) 
<HelloKit> 4That's great, Headake... how's it working out? 
<dannyc> Kit: sorry, I just have to ask... you all have 
    romantic situations? 
<Mooooooo> I dont 
<Mooooooo> im single 
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<HelloKit> Well, dannyc, sometimes a situation is the fact 
    that you don't have a situation. 
<Headake> well I think that it is going better than ever, 
    there are times, but overall it's nice 
<Mooooooo> last g/f was half a year ago and she was a 
    flaming nut case 
* phoenyxx is so single NBC almost hired him for a sitcom 
    :-) 
<HelloKit> And that's fine. 
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<Mooooooo> Hi Han :o) 
<Lao-tzu> Hello everybody 
<HelloKit> 4Heya Lao-tzu... we're updating each other on 
    our 'love lives'... join in if you like. 
<Headake> phoenxx don't worry about the the single life, I 
    stressed for 7 years, then POW! she hit me! 
<Mooooooo> did you hit her back? 
<Mooooooo> /:o) 
<al2> or front? 
<Mooooooo> lol 
<Amazin1> haha 
<HelloKit> LOL you guys 
<phoenyxx> Headake- I know, I'm 27 and just now finishing 
    college. Hopefully if I can get my video production 
    business off the ground I'd have more time 
<phoenyxx> to meet people :-) 
<Headake> no I stepped on her toes... 
<Deb> i have a cyber boyfriend 
<Ray1> How did u meet him? 
<HelloKit> Cool, Deb. 
<Mooooooo> cool deb :o) 
<Lao-tzu> Well my better half is away from home right now, 
    ...far away, ...oooh so far away and it doesn't seem to 
    make a difference -- I still miss her! 
<Deb> I actually met him on the IRC ;-) 
<Headake> I know how you feel lau-tzu 
<Mooooooo> :o) 
<phoenyxx> I've got one friend telling how great the net 
    is for meeting people, and another friend warning me not 
    to risk it. 
<Mooooooo> simon, i think the risks are the same 
<Lao-tzu> Thanks, Scott :-) 
<Deb> I think it's safe - I've met real people from on 
    line in person 
* Headake has to run, I've got to check on my other half 
    (she not feeling good) 
<HelloKit> Sounds like me vs. Daniel, Simon... 
<Headake> bye all...maybe later. 
<Mooooooo> i see little difference between meeting from the 
    net and meeting from work. church, school 
<phoenyxx> Mooooo: I feel the same way. 
<Mooooooo> see ya headake 
<al2> ttfn headake 
<Lao-tzu> byy headake 
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<Mooooooo> Carly got somone nice, and I got a monster 
<HelloKit> Oh dear... now I'm choking myself on apple 
    cider. 
<DopeHat> heh 
<Mooooooo> law of averages 
<DopeHat> so far i've met a nice one 
<Mooooooo> but, im not bitter (just pissed off) 
<HelloKit> LOL 
<al2> hehe mooo 
<phoenyxx> What's weird is that in the area of 
    relationships, it's the one area I'm still shy about the 
    chair. 
<HelloKit> Well, I think it's easier to tell with some 
    people than others. 
<al2> i'll see if i can find that nurse for ya, mooo 
<phoenyxx> I know I'm worrying too much, and most people 
    are cool about it anyway, but for some reason I still get 
    nervous about it. 
<Mooooooo> yeah 
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<Mooooooo> hi tigger 
<tigger> hi 
* DopeHat is single but spending alot of time with someone 
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* Mooooooo is happy for Keith :o) 
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<Mooooooo> oops 
<HelloKit> Usually I'm pretty good with the intuition 
    thing... knowing if someone is 'safe' or not. There have 
    been a couple times when I've been wrong, but for the 
    most part I've been right on target. 
<phoenyxx> Carly- I do the same thing, just let my 
    instincts guide me, so to speak. 
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<HelloKit> And I never would have given Chris all the 
    information I did if I had had the slightest doubts about 
    his sanity. 
<HelloKit> hehe 
<Mooooooo> i dunno. in retrospect i need she was nuts but 
    I wanted love so bad 
<Mooooooo> so i overlooked it 
<Mooooooo> but i knew it all along 
<Mooooooo> welcome back tigger 
<tiggertwo> thanks 
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* HelloKit . o O ( Now I know all about his sanity... 
    ) 
<Mooooooo> well at least Chris was housebroken, Carly 
<HelloKit> ROFL 
<al2> deb... do you live in arizona? 
<Ray1> I came in late, mooooo. Where did you meet this 
    prize? 
<phoenyxx> Arizona is a UFO hotspot. 
<Mooooooo> i met her on irc 
<Mooooooo> then went to see her 
<al2> arizona is a redneck hotspot, too 
<HelloKit> LOL 
<tiggertwo> Mooooooooo, I have been there too 
<phoenyxx> al2- as bad as Texas? :-) 
<Lao-tzu> Only when you don't cover your head :-) 
<al2> phoenyxx... probly the same 
<Mooooooo> hey, no knocking my home to be 
<HelloKit> LOL 
<phoenyxx> I hear dueling banjos :-) 
<Mooooooo> lol 
<Mooooooo> :oP 
<HelloKit> 4Okay, I have another question for you guys... 
<al2> i hear people saying 'sheeeeeyittt!' 
<Mooooooo> lol 
<phoenyxx> al2- I usually yell 'son of a Hillary' :-) 
<al2> hehe 
<Mooooooo> lol 
<HelloKit> 4Has anyone found that even if the disability 
    isn't an issue in the beginning, it begins to become a 
    burden to the relationship later on? 
<al2> yes 
<phoenyxx> I have not run into that (yet) 
<tiggertwo> in what ways does it become a burden? 
<Mooooooo> depends on what you mean by burden? 
<al2> pain in the butt 
<Amazin1> burden? 
<Mooooooo> life aint easy, no matter who you are 
<HelloKit> Chris and I always try hard to work through 
    everything... but sometimes it seems as if he's annoyed by 
    having to help me with some things. 
<Mooooooo> burden makes it sound like an activity that you 
    loathe doing 
<al2> loathe seems a bit harsh.... dislike sounds better 
<HelloKit> Maybe not by the fact that he has to help me, 
    but the fact that it may sometimes coincide with him being 
    busy with something else. 
<Mooooooo> Chris will have to get used to it because that 
    is the person he plans to marry 
<DopeHat> i feel like my disability would be a burden 
<phoenyxx> What I'm most concerned about is making sure 
    that any potential problems are dealt with in the 
    beginning. 
<Mooooooo> Carly, that has nothing to do with being 
    disabled, thats just life 
<phoenyxx> I don't want something suddenly becoming a 
    problem when it wasn't one before. 
<HelloKit> Well I'm not even sure if he really feels that 
    way - it seems like it to me, but it may just be my 
    imagination. 
<Amazin1> I guess it depends of if you are dating abled 
    bodied or disabled 
<phoenyxx> Carly- I know I worry more about what other 
    people think, when really they're ok with it. 
<DopeHat> i feel like my disability would be a burden 
<HelloKit> For example, he sits down to play his new video 
    game (which doesn't pause and only allows you to save at 
    certain points)... ten minutes later I have to use the 
    restroom. 
<al2> dopehat... what is your disability? 
<HelloKit> And he sorta... growls. Y'know? 
<DopeHat> MD 
<al2> ok.. 
<Mooooooo> yep 
<Mooooooo> im the same way when the phone rings 
<HelloKit> LOL 
<HelloKit> But see, when the phone rings it's not my 
    fault. But if I make him stop to take me pee, I feel 
    bad. 
<al2> call him up and ask 
<Mooooooo> you having to pee isnt your fault 
<HelloKit> ROFL 
<Lao-tzu> My better half and I lived together before my 
    accident. The accident strenghtened the relationship because 
    the disability acted as a filter to keep banal issues out 
    the way leaving the real feelings exposed and we got 
    married. It's sort of like working excessively in the name 
    of providing for your loved ones and *all they really 
    need* is you. 
<al2> yeah... better than peeing right there 
<phoenyxx> Carly, I've had people who's job it was to help 
    make me feel bad about just carrying books or holding a 
    door open for me. 
<phoenyxx> I used to assume that everyone got pissed of 
    about helping because of a few slackers at the college. 
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<phoenyxx> Mabye I am really naive, but I've always figured 
    that the attitude in a relationship would be different than 
    that. 
<HelloKit> I've had an experience like that, Simon. A very 
    unpleasant experience... 
<phoenyxx> Carly- right! In my experience, most people are 
    decent about it, and all my friends don't have a problem 
    with accomodating me and the chair. 
<phoenyxx> I figure a potentioal girlfriend would be cool 
    about it. 
<phoenyxx> potential I mean. 
<Lao-tzu> So when she helps me, I know she knows she 
    doesn't *have* to do it, she does it with real interest 
    and without any irritation. 
<Mooooooo> i think you're right Han 
<phoenyxx> My woman friend has helped me push and holds 
    doors open, without giving it a second thought. 
<HelloKit> In the summer of '95 - the same year I met 
    Chris - I went to a two-week summer study at the 
    University of Washington. I brought another girl from my 
    high school, whom I didn't know well, to be my attendant. 
<phoenyxx> brb 
<al2> she turned out to be a flake? 
<Amazin1> g'nite all ...... 
<al2> ttfn 
<Mooooooo> nite Denise 
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<HelloKit> By the end of the two weeks, I hated her. She 
    was always complaining about having to help me, she called 
    me picky when I would ask her to fix my food the way I 
    like it (i.e. extra salt on the fries, mayo on my 
    burgers)... and she made me adjust my personal care 
    schedule around her socializing. 
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<Mooooooo> how old was she? 
<HelloKit> 19 I think 
<Mooooooo> 19 and still in highschool? 
<phoenyxx> back 
<HelloKit> She had just graduated. 
<Mooooooo> that should have clued you in :o) 
<HelloKit> Heh... 
<HelloKit> It wasn't my choice... my parents met her while 
    I was at camp, and had already told her she was going by 
    the time I met her. 
<Mooooooo> she was drafted? 
<HelloKit> I was mad; I didn't think it was fair that 
    they told her that without even asking me. 
<Lao-tzu> If you have an attendant, shouldn't the 
    relationship be employer/employee -- you should establish the 
    rules and they would have to respect them or expect to be 
    replaced. ...No? 
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<HelloKit> Well, we had been searching all summer... I had 
    asked some friends who couldn't go. This was a last 
    resort. 
<Lao-tzu> Carly: you have that right! 
<kb9kyy> hi all 
<Mooooooo> hi brad 
<Lao-tzu> Hi Brad 
<kb9kyy> jinx 
<HelloKit> 4So anyway, back to romance... 
<kb9kyy> nc 
<HelloKit> 4Is anyone in a relationship with another 
    disabled person? 
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<Mooooooo> nope 
<Mooooooo> hi ragdoll 
<kb9kyy> does being insane count? *g* 
<ragdoll> hi 
<kb9kyy> just kidding 
* Lao-tzu is not 
<HelloKit> 4Welcome ragdoll... I was just asking if anyone 
    here is in a relationship with another disabled person. 
<ragdoll> i was 
<Mooooooo> and what happened? 
<Lao-tzu> hi ragdoll, 'was'? 
<ragdoll> nothing really just kind of drifted apart but we 
    are still really good friends 
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<Mooooooo> hi hanover 
<kb9kyy> hi hanover 
<Mooooooo> thats too bad 
<phoenyxx> I'm good friends with someone in a chair- she 
    went to the same college I'm finishing up at. 
<hanover9> hi all 
<HelloKit> 4The reason I brought that up is something I 
    found in my old e-mail... Becky18 mentioned that she had 
    noticed people taking disabled w/ disabled relationships as 
    entertainment... 
<Lao-tzu> hi hanover 
<kb9kyy> what a crock! 
<HelloKit> 4People thought it was cute to see two disabled 
    people together... has anyone had a similar experience? 
<kb9kyy> go easy on the color 
<ragdoll> my friend only had one arm and was a good lover 
<kb9kyy> no comment 
<al2> hehe.. no comment here, too 
<Mooooooo> yeah, especially from you al2 :oP 
<Mooooooo> hehehe 
<al2> aw shux 
<Mooooooo> unless she was your nurs 
<Mooooooo> nurse 
<kb9kyy> lol 
<al2> no comment 
<HelloKit> Personally, I do understand what she is talking 
    about. I've seen it happen, but I think it's something 
    pretty isolated to high school and thereabouts. I don't 
    think mature adults would act that way... or am I wrong? 
<al2> who cares what they think anyway 
<kb9kyy> yeah! 
<HelloKit> Shoot... I deleted the e-mail. 
<kb9kyy> dang 
<HelloKit> I was going to paste in what Becky wrote... 
<kb9kyy> 9:00 
<al2> is daylight savings over? 
<kb9kyy> no, i'm eastern time 
<Lao-tzu> Time flies like an arrow and fruit flies like 
    bananas 
<HelloKit> Nope, not til 10/26 
<kb9kyy> lol 
<al2> ok 
<al2> we don't have it here 
<kb9kyy> where are you, al2? 
<phoenyxx> hey everyone, I'll see you all later. got to go 
    now :-) 
<al2> aridzona 
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<kb9kyy> lol 
<kb9kyy> we don't have it in Indiana, either 
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<HelloKit> That was pleasant... 
<al2> entertaining, too 
<Lao-tzu> uuhh? 
<kb9kyy> lol 
<HelloKit> LOL al2 
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<kb9kyy> why isn't there a topic? 
<al2> wonder if sashaa flunked the test 
<kb9kyy> LOL 
<HelloKit> ROFL! 
<Lao-tzu> he, he 
<kb9kyy> good one, al2!!!! best laugh i've had all night 
<Mooooooo> lol 
<Lao-tzu> All the way from Israel too (maybe) 
*** LOG CLOSED: Thu Oct  9 02:04:45 1997