*** LOG OPENED: Wed Mar 11 18:03:51 1998
---
Participants:
  HandiBot
  Disabled
  MrLinux
  ChanServ
  Mooooooo (dse@pacific.net)
  gregsgg
  HelloKit (carlym@u.washington.edu)
  jrt (twyford@sv.net.au)
  maggie
  Mimi (mimi@lino.com)
  usn21
  CincyKid
  TODD
  keteri
---
<Mimi> lol 
<HelloKit> logging is on 
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<HelloKit> lol Debbie 
<Mimi> Simon :o) 
<MrLinux> hello 
<HelloKit> Hey Simon 
<phoenyxx> good evening everyone! 
<phoenyxx> Mimi! :-) 
<Mimi> how are ya? 
<jrt> evening:) 
<MrLinux> %-) 
<phoenyxx> hey Carly :-) 
* HelloKit clears her throat... 
<phoenyxx> just fine Mimi. 
<HelloKit> Are we ready to start? 
<Mimi> yes :o) 
<MrLinux> yes 
<phoenyxx> ready! 
<phoenyxx> locked and loaded :-) 
<TODD> First time here what happens at 9 
<usn21> first for me too. 
<phoenyxx> TODD: I start telling bad jokes :-) 
<maggie> me too 
<Mimi> argh... 
<TODD> oh oh 
<Mimi> ;o) 
<maggie> lol 
<Mimi> watch out todd... 
<jrt> behave.... 
<TODD> ok 
<HelloKit> Okay everyone... sorry I didn't get around to 
    choosing a topic sooner. But as of about a half hour ago, 
    tonight's topic is 'Friendships'. 
<TODD> WHOOSE IN CHARGE?????? 
<jrt> ping me 
<HelloKit> First question... 
<phoenyxx> 9 seconds jrt 
<HelloKit> 12 secs Debbie 
<MrLinux> 13 sec 
<jrt> thanks:) 
<HelloKit> Do you think friendships are more important, less 
    important, or equally important to you as they are to 
    non-disabled people? 
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<Mimi> hi kevin 
<jrt> yes I have friendships with both and they are both 
    as important as one another:) 
<maggie> think more important because some disabilities 
    precurse isolation 
<MrLinux> i agree 
<TODD> there shouldn't be a difference 
<Mooooooo> i think we take friendships more seriously 
<phoenyxx> to me just as important, some of my friends 
    have known me years, before the chair, and I've also met 
    many new friends who are cool about it. 
<Mooooooo> and are hurt far more when betrayed 
<phoenyxx> total agreement daniel. 
<MrLinux> thats true too 
<jrt> true daniel 
<phoenyxx> I almost had my show taken away by a group of 
    'friends' who realized hanging out with me was more than 
    just me doing wheelies. 
<phoenyxx> serious betrayal 
<HelloKit> I can't say I've ever actually been betrayed, 
    but I have had friendships fade away because the friend 
    had to grow up and move on to better things while I 
    couldn't. 
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<phoenyxx> Most of my friends have been really cool about 
    me and the chair, and very helpful when I've been down 
    about it. 
<Mimi> what do you mean, 'better' things, Carly? 
<jrt> until I joined this channel I had only a small 
    group of friends, but know feel that I have friends all 
    over the world:) 
<MrLinux> i have been betrayed by one of my best friends 
    that really made me upset, because i trusted them 
<phoenyxx> so true jrt :-) 
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<HelloKit> Well, for instance, a friend once planned a 
    roller skating party for her birthday, completely forgetting 
    that I wouldn't be able to go. 
<Mimi> I thought I had a few far-away friends until I 
    joined this channel, but now I know, from people here, 
    what true friendship is and I'm disappointed in the others 
<HelloKit> As we got older my friends needed to be able 
    to go out and be active... do 'grown-up' things that I 
    couldn't do. 
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<phoenyxx> Carly- back in 1994 after my show had been on 
    a few months the group that helped me start it told me I 
    wouldn't lose the show if the chair was less visible when 
    we were together, so I was required to transfer to a 
    couch and have the 
<phoenyxx> chair taken out of the room when taping. 
<TODD> its hard not to do the physical things as i did 
    before 
<jrt> that sucks phoenyxx... 
<HelloKit> What effect do good friendships have on your 
    ability to cope with your disability? 
<maggie> does family members try to do to much ...tkae the 
    place of friends instead of being family? 
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<HelloKit> Not mine, Maggie. 
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<phoenyxx> jrt: definitely but I was in so much trouble 
    back then, I had just gotten the chair I have now and 
    that group was cool about it to start with but over a 
    few months starting having a problem with it. 
<phoenyxx> maggie: not me 
<keteri> good luck at your meeting, 
<gregsgg> here we go 
<usn21> I'm connected throughy eskimo.com 
<maggie> thanks phoenyxx 
<gregsgg> well be right back 
<gregsgg> dinner 
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<usn21> later 
<jrt> no most people that know my problem are amazed how 
    I deal with it more... 
<MrLinux> can i say supmthing, please? 
<phoenyxx> has anyone else had 'friends' issue 'ultimatums' 
    about you and your disability vs. the rest of the group? 
<phoenyxx> go MrLinux- 
<Mimi> well, since I'm so isolated here at home, my IRC 
    friends make life SOOOO much better 
<jrt> yes and no??? 
<MrLinux> i think a big part of a friendship is trust 
<jrt> yes scott it is 
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<TODD> why do we lose some of our friends when we become 
    disablrd??? 
<phoenyxx> so true MrLinux 
<Mimi> hi Jettin 
<Jettin> hi everyone 
<Jettin> hi mimi 
<MrLinux> and without trust there is no true friendship 
<TODD> nice spelling disabled 
<jrt> because they are not REAL friends in the first 
    place.. 
<TODD> I don't that is true 
<phoenyxx> I didn't lose friends, but some people that came 
    later sometimes were jerks about it, although a guy I knew 
    from high school told me that if I ever reached a high 
    position despite the chair he'd personally have me killed. 
<usn21> carly; are you starting the meeting? 
<TODD> its deeper than that 
<phoenyxx> jrt: right on the mark there :-) 
<HelloKit> oh jeez Simon 
<MrLinux> TRUST is the deepest u can get 
<jrt> and respect scott that is omportant too... 
<TODD> unconditional friendship is the most important 
<jrt> important 
<MrLinux> that is true also 
<phoenyxx> carly: not joking that time. Seriously, I've 
    pissed some people off just being visible doing the things 
    I like. The real irony is that my real friends are all 
    able bodied except one friend from the college and all are 
    very supportive. 
<phoenyxx> logging off per handibot order. 
<phoenyxx> out in 5 minutes.... 
<TODD> whats that all about 
<maggie> go away sherrie 
<maggie> has been popping occ 
<jrt> you too maggie.. 
<HelloKit> Do you tend to have a lot of casual 
    friendships, or just a few close friends? 
<MrLinux> could u explain that 
<Mimi> I have just a few close friends...always have 
<jrt> a few close friends plus everybody on here:) 
<phoenyxx> for me mostly close friends, although some 
    aquaintances have become quick friends :-) 
<MrLinux> i do too 
<HelloKit> :o) 
<MrLinux> that true jrt 
<Mimi> I've never been a very social person really 
<phoenyxx> I didn't say any profanity that time! 
<HelloKit> I have a lot of 'acquaintances', but only a few 
    close friends. 
<jrt> lol 
<Jettin> hi maggie, stayin warm 
<maggie> yes trying to get handle on how to help brother 
<usn21> choose yo0ur friends carefully, not for what they 
    can do fdor you but, foe their example of what you want 
    to be and for what they can teach you. 
<MrLinux> close friends is a good foundation 
<MrLinux> to fall back on 
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<Mimi> I totally agree usn 
<phoenyxx> me too usn 
<TODD> me too 
<jrt> yes like the saying goes,'you can choose your 
    friends, but not your realatives'. 
<MrLinux> me too 
<TODD> lol jrt 
<Jettin> how is that going, maggie 
<usn21> it takes work 
<Mimi> we can chose some of our relatives :o/ 
<jrt> well yeah I suppose,,, 
<maggie> talk later jettin listening to meeting now' 
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<HelloKit> For those who acquired disabilities later in 
    life, did you find that becoming disabled affected your 
    friendships? 
<Mimi> wb John 
<CincyKid> hmmm, having severe lag problems here 
<MrLinux> try irc.bluegrass.net 
<maggie> think disabled later shows who true friends are 
<HelloKit> No lag, John... 2 secs 
<usn21> some people are afraid to have disabled friends 
    because they don't know what to say and/or we represent a 
    reminder of just how fragile thyeey are too. 
<jrt> ummmm, its hard to say,my disablity doesn't really 
    get noticed unless I tell them... 
<TODD> it wrecked some and made others stronger 
<phoenyxx> I've been in the chair 5 years this month (the 
    11th) and my orginal friends I had known since 1985, 1988, 
    and 1990, and they were cool about it from the start. 
<Mimi> well, I'm not sure if it affected my friendships 
    but since mine isn't immediately obvious I have a hard 
    time talking about it to my friends because they get 
    weird...I hate that 
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<phoenyxx> Mimi: out weird them then! :-) works for me 
    with my friends :-) 
<MrLinux> i would not let it effect my friendships, because 
    if they cant except u for what u r then they aint true 
    friends 
<jrt> I kinda know what you mean Mimi.. 
<usn21> yes people sort of disappeasred after I was 
    disabled 
<Mimi> but I think they might get weird because I'm not 
    comfortable with it myself, too 
<TODD> being disabled is not *cool* how could we change 
    it???????????? 
<maggie> after new disability did find friendships awkward 
    at first..don't know what to say or do? 
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<Mimi> hi Ray 
<jrt> Hi Ray:) 
<usn21> Good point Mimi, we need to be more cheerful and 
    not try to obtain any pity. 
<Mimi> after a seizure, yep, maggie 
<phoenyxx> usually I've been the one who's awkward until I 
    notice most people are ok about the chair when they first 
    meet me. 
<Ray-1> Good evening, everyone! 
<jrt> yes well like I said no bodies knows about mine 
    unless I tell them, then they knida move evrytihing around 
    so I wont trip over it.. 
<phoenyxx> one way to make disability cool- change the 
    handicapped logo from the blue with white wheelchair logo 
    to a armored fist clutching a cluster of lightning bolts. 
    :-) 
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<maggie> find myself trying to 'help' when maybe I should 
    back off 
<HelloKit> lol 
<usn21> I don't nee a cxhair anymorebut, I assure you hat 
    people are just as wierd about my handicap 
<jrt> I make more of a joke out of my dissablity.. 
<TODD> cool phoenyx 
<phoenyxx> jrt: I do that alot sometimes, and it works to 
    put people at ease. 
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<phoenyxx> some people are uncomfortable but most people 
    meet me and are cool about it if they see me being at 
    ease with it. 
<TODD> you set the tone with your attitude 
<HelloKit> What do you think can help keep friendships 
    going after someone becomes disabled? 
<jrt> yes at first woth mee nayways they dont know how to 
    reacte, then they accept it.. 
<phoenyxx> TODD: that logo used to be on every American 
    bomber armed with nuclear weapons btw. 
<usn21> that's the ticket 
<Mimi> openness and honesty 
<TODD> good info px 
<jrt> yes I agree mimi:) 
<MrLinux> yes 
<phoenyxx> not sure about that carly, the people that knew 
    be before, I didn't really need to work at keeping them 
    around. we just got back into making videos like it was 
    no big deal. 
<jrt> and try not too be too obvious about the persons 
    disablity.. 
<MrLinux> i think, well i know i can 
<phoenyxx> good advice Mimi :-) 
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<Mimi> hi lisa 
<jrt> Hi Lisa:) 
<usn21> its all in our attitude 
<MrLinux> hello LISA 
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<Mimi> hey Denise 
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<Amazin1> Mimi :) 
<HelloKit> Hi Lisa and Denise :o) Current question is... 
<Mimi> how are ya? 
<HelloKit> What do you think can help keep friendships 
    going after someone becomes disabled? 
<jrt> yes you be relaxed and most other people will be as 
    well 
<usn21> our positive attitude and smile is catching. it 
    should become an epidemic 
<phoenyxx> usn21: like from the movie the stand :-) 
<TODD> i think you have to talk about your disability with 
    your friends and be real open about it. we are the ones 
    that have to keep the friendships going 
<elisabeth> hello 
<jrt> trying not to over protect the disabled friend 
<HelloKit> Oh yeah, people can't help but laugh when they 
    see my face ;o) 
<Amazin1> great, Mimi :) 
<keteri> when you become disabled suddenly because of an 
    accident...you might need a long time to recover...in the 
    hospital physical theraphy all new life ways....so your 
    energy and your way of life is changed ...then your 
    friends lives go on their ususal way. and truely you still 
    love them but you need to get through things....so i 
    isolate friends because of that..and then once better the 
    distance has been far and it is hard to get back to that 
    friendshipl....lo 
<MrLinux> then they r just in the wrong Carly 
<Ray-1> brb 
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<MrLinux> they r just too pigheaded to look past that to 
    see the real person inside 
<HelloKit> Hehe... I was joking, Scott... 
<jrt> why Carly theres nothing wrong with your face that I 
    could see on your web page?? 
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<Mimi> lol 
<jrt> okay:) 
<MrLinux> well, what i still said is true also 
<Mimi> Carly, I got your joke :o) 
<usn21> we have to be patient at all times with all 
    things. 
<maggie> sometimes you try not to show that being disabled 
    creates hardships and friend feel shut out by the denial 
<MrLinux> people need to quit judging others by their 
    covers, it whats on the inside that counts 
<jrt> yes once people know my disablity they always treat 
    me like I'm either elderly or a kid with some things 
<phoenyxx> what helped with myself and my friends was 
    simply to go out and have fun with them and not worry 
    about the chair so much. 
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<Sky> Moo? 
<Mimi> hey Sky :o) 
<Sky> hi hon 
<jrt> thats right phoenyxx 
<Sky> how are u? 
<phoenyxx> I think when people see someone with a 
    disability out with friends like everyone else that actually 
    helps people accept disability in general. 
<phoenyxx> thanks jrt :-) 
<Mimi> how are ya dear? 
* Mimi hugs Sky 
* Sky hugzs her girlie back 
<Mimi> hehe 
<Sky> whers Moo? 
<Jettin> yeah, but society doesn't allow that all the time, 
    MrLinux 
<HelloKit> Does your disability affect your ability to make 
    new friends? 
<jrt> no not really.. 
<MrLinux> then society is in the wrong 
<Mimi> nah...my personality does ;o) 
<phoenyxx> overall Carly, I've made many new friends who 
    have totally accepted it. 
<MrLinux> well thats my opinion 
<jrt> but my attitude is like it or lump it, if they 
    cant accept you for what you are too bad 
<HelloKit> I'm really shy and do have a hard time making 
    friends, but since I've always been disabled I don't really 
    know whether it can be attributed to that. 
<Amazin1> heh..Mimi 
<usn21> mimi , do yopu need a personality transplant? find 
    any donors? 
<Mimi> lol 
<HelloKit> lol 
<jrt> lol 
<phoenyxx> what's weird is that I'm sort of shy and open 
    at the same time- wanting to meet people but always a 
    little nervous at first. 
<elisabeth> at work i meet all kinds of people, with me 
    and most people i work with, we don't see the chair or 
    the respirator, we see the person and how they treat 
    people 
<Amazin1> I'm a very open, happy, positive person...People 
    just *flock* to me, then they notice I have a disabilty 
    :) 
<phoenyxx> good one elisabeth :-) 
<Mimi> :o) 
<Jettin> what person isn't, phoenyxx 
<TODD> i have that problem too amaze 
<HelloKit> problem... lol 
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<phoenyxx> I had one woman watch my cable TV show, contact 
    me to meet in person, and she didn't notice the chair on 
    TV! I told her on the phone we needed to meet someplace 
    accessable, and only then did she realize I was in a 
    chair. 
<phoenyxx> but she's really nice though :-) 
<Mooooooo> i have to go 
<phoenyxx> true jrt :-) 
<Mimi> I don't think I could handle people flocking to me, 
    I like my privacy and peace and quiet 
<Mooooooo> back later 
<Mimi> aww bye Daniel 
<jrt> :( 
<Mooooooo> bye 
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<HelloKit> bye Daniel *hugs* 
<phoenyxx> bye Daniel 
<Amazin1> problem? 
<MrLinux> probly mad cause i am here 
<elisabeth> me to mimi 
<HelloKit> No Scott 
<HelloKit> He told me earlier he would have to leave 
    early. 
<jrt> I do but I like to be with my friends too:) 
<usn21> I must go too so goodnighyt to all. 
<Mimi> bye usn! 
<Mimi> take care 
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<phoenyxx> the big problem now is to get my friends to 
    stop making 'Quickie' jokes when they see my chair :-) 
<HelloKit> lol 
<Mimi> lol 
<Mimi> jinx 
<TODD> how about a quickie 
<phoenyxx> 4 years using this chair and still the jokes! 
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<HelloKit> :oP Mimi 
<phoenyxx> TODD: just like that :-) 
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<TODD> i get them too phx 
<HelloKit> What have you found that helps you to make 
    friends? 
<elisabeth> phoenyxx, that is a given, i have quickie 
    buttons on my board 
<Mimi> a computer 
<Amazin1> I'm guilty of that phoenyxx..my friend recently 
    got a quickie :) 
<Mimi> :o) 
<phoenyxx> TODD: got a Quickie chair too? I have a GPV 
    from April 1994 
<HelloKit> Good one Mimi :o) 
<Mimi> hehe 
<jrt> the computer and my dogs and Sarah 
<phoenyxx> amazin: actually the jokes are funny, I have a 
    sense of humor about it. 
<TODD> me too midnight purple phx 
<Jettin> phoenyxx, tell them straight out, enough is enough, 
    if their real friends they won't get affended. 
<jrt> or and my horse when I have them.. 
<phoenyxx> mine is black with silver trim. 
<HelloKit> Jokes can be made about my 'Action' as well... 
<Mimi> yeah...horses if I have one :o) 
<phoenyxx> Jettin: no the jokes aren't too bad. 
<HelloKit> But not as funny as 'Quickie' jokes :o) 
<Jettin> but, after a while they get annoying, day in and 
    day out 
<phoenyxx> what i like doing is sitting back on my rear 
    wheels while having a casual conversation with someone, to 
    see how long they talk to me before freaking out that I'm 
    on two wheels :-) 
<TODD> how would you define FRIEND 
<CincyKid> gettin late, have to go unfortunately....goodnite 
    to all. 
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<jrt> night:) 
<Jettin> bye 
<maggie> bye jettin catch you nlater 
<MrLinux> a friend is a person that is there thoughout 
    thick and thin, and one u can trust no matter what! 
<MrLinux> thats what i think 
<elisabeth> // 
<phoenyxx> total agreement :-) 
<jrt> trus scott:) 
<jrt> true 
<Mimi> a friend is someone who understands your needs and 
    expects you to do the same 
<phoenyxx> Mimi: on the mark there :-) 
<Jettin> see you all later, bye 
<jrt> bye:) 
<Mimi> bye Jettin 
<MrLinux> thats is so true mimi 
<MrLinux> later 
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<Mimi> LOL 
<Mimi> that was Pam! 
<jrt> lol 
<Mimi> hehe 
<elisabeth> bye bye, have to go 
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<HelloKit> lol 
<Mimi> s/he just won't give up, will...it? 
<phoenyxx> every figured out her MO? one of ParaCathy's 
    minions? 
<HelloKit> lol 
<Mimi> lol 
<jrt> persisitant little s***!!!!!! 
<HelloKit> What advice would you give to a disabled person 
    who is having difficulty making and/or keeping friendships? 
<Mimi> dunno Simon...some nutcase anyway 
<HelloKit> Simon... did you hear/see what happened to 
    ParaCathy? 
<jrt> well it depends on there attitude for one.. 
<phoenyxx> advice....just that real friends will hang around 
    despite the disability. 
<phoenyxx> what happened to ParaCathy? 
<Mimi> attitude counts though 
<jrt> dont put yourself down 
<maggie> maggie leaving bedtime 
<HelloKit> Someone from the New Mobility message board 
    hacked her home page and changed it all... she was stupid 
    enough to be using her name as her password. 
<maggie> bye 
<Mimi> LOL Carly 
<Mimi> what did they do to it? 
<phoenyxx> Carly: really? I would have paid to see that 
    :-) 
<jrt> Bye:) 
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<HelloKit> I wish I had seen it; I would have saved it 
    and put it up somewhere else :o) 
<Mimi> rofl 
<Mimi> darn 
<TODD> would anyone ever try to contact a friend that left 
    the relationship years ago?? 
<jrt> yes 
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<Amazin1> who is paracathy? 
<TODD> why 
<jrt> Hi Raven:) 
<Mimi> not if they 'left', but I would if they just faded 
    away 
<Raven_> hihi 
<Mimi> ParaCathy is a wannabe 
<Raven_> i missed the meeting :( 
<HelloKit> A sicko... she's a wannabe - she wants to be 
    disabled for sexual reasons. 
<jrt> if you want to see the person again,why not.. 
<Raven_> MIMI 
<TODD> does she wana be quad cathy 
<jrt> yes i know carly a real sicko.. 
<Mimi> hey Raven!! 
<HelloKit> eek, this is being logged btw 
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<phoenyxx> whole wannabe thing is weird...and some disabled 
    people accuse legit disabled people of being wannabes so in 
    a sense, what ParaCathy does is a double threat. 
<jrt> oops 
<HelloKit> Anyone have anything else to add to the topic 
    of friendships before I turn off the log? 
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<Mimi> hi guys :o) 
<TODD> A TRUE PERSONS WEALTH IS MEASURED BY FRIENDS NOT 
    MONEY 
<jrt> the only thing I can think of, is if you want true 
    friends, stay on the disabled channel:) 
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*** LOG CLOSED: Wed Mar 11 19:02:43 1998