*** LOG OPENED: Wed Jan 21 18:03:20 1998
---
Participants:
  Disabled
  Mimi (mimi@lino.com)
  HandiBot
  BuBbAGump
  tractor
  Mooooooo (dse@pacific.net)
  ChanServ
  turbokev
  jrt (twyford@sv.net.au)
  judi
  Raven_
  Countrybo (jpatterson@centuryinter.net)
  phoenyxx (simon@texas.net)
  HelloKit (carlym@u.washington.edu)
---
<phoenyxx> judi- good one! I now need to find something 
    that can hold more, if you know what I mean, in case I 
    run across another locked bathroom! 
<jrt> now we have to be serious here you know:) 
* Countrybo wants to know is it me or has anyone ever 
    noticed how the doc's offices for injured people and the 
    lawyers offices for said same are mostly not hadiapped 
    accessible? lol 
<judi> Uh oh, are the handicap ever politically correct? 
<phoenyxx> judi- I'm not! :-) 
<Raven_> jewl mimi 
<Countrybo> well just run for office lol 
<judi> I know that phoenyxx 
<Mooooooo> for the record 
* Mooooooo is a single 34 year old Politically Incorrect 
    Jesus Loving Christian American Capitalist Heterosexual 
    Pro-Life Pro-Choice Flag Waving Conservative Libertarian 
    Environmental Reactivist and card carrying member of the 
    NRA. I'm a darn nice guy. 
<judi> Lol 
<Raven_> ADA has relaxed IMO 
<HelloKit> Okay... I think I'm ready, how about the rest 
    of us? 
<judi> Lol lol lol 
<phoenyxx> Raven- problem I see with ADA is that the wrong 
    people get to use it. 
<Mooooooo> ready :o) 
<Countrybo> wow 
<jrt> I suppose:) 
<judi> Ready as ever 
<Raven_> i agree 
<tractor> ready 
<HelloKit> What are some examples of political correctness 
    (i.e. terms, actions)? 
<Countrybo> is that anything like a left over hippie type 
    christian redneck? 
<phoenyxx> examples I've seen- people getting really uptight 
    when one of us tries to be funny! 
<tractor> lol 
<judi> In what context? 
<Mooooooo> smug people using the word 'physically challenged' 
<jrt> not calling aborignees, 'abbo's'... 
<phoenyxx> right on the mark daniel! 
<HelloKit> heh 
<Raven_> being non'offenseive to anyone...a pipedream 
<Mimi> now you supposedly have to say 'people with 
    epilepsy' instead of 'epileptics' :oP 
<phoenyxx> not calling able bodied 'spawns of Satan' :-) 
<Countrybo> hehe its a challenge to refrain from physically 
    smakin the smug ones lol 
<judi> Physically challenged wow 
* Mimi wonders what the hell the difference is 
<HelloKit> Ooh Mimi... big difference! 
<Mooooooo> practicers of epilepticion 
<Mimi> lol 
<HelloKit> lol 
<phoenyxx> to me disabled sounds a bit harsh but I prefer 
    honestly over euphemism...euphemisms don't make the condition 
    go away. 
<Mooooooo> im proud to be.... 
*** Mooooooo is now known as GimpCow
<HelloKit> lol 
<Mimi> lol 
<jrt> lol 
<tractor> lol 
*** HelloKit is now known as GimpKitty
<GimpKitty> ;o) 
*** Mimi is now known as Epileptic
<phoenyxx> take a page from Brave New World....'Epsilon and 
    proud of it!' :-) 
<GimpKitty> rofl 
<Epileptic> oops, that was suypposed to be 'Epileptica' 
*** Epileptic is now known as Mimi
<Mimi> too long, oh well 
*** GimpKitty is now known as HelloKit
*** GimpCow is now known as HandiCow
<jrt> ?me is known as the blind leading the blind... 
<tractor> lol 
<judi> How about just Gimp Group 
<tractor> kewl 
<tractor> gimpsters 
<HandiCow> lol 
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<Countrybo> Welcome to #disabled ChanServ! 
<judi> Mimi, when I. taught diabetes education we were 
    encouraged not to say diabetics 
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<phoenyxx> everyone using the term gimp brings up another 
    question....no one likes to hear slurs or derogatory 
    terminology, but what do you all think of other disabled 
    people using 
<phoenyxx> terms like 'crip' and 'gimp'? 
<Mimi> why, Judi? 
<Countrybo> how about free wheelers? 
<HelloKit> Doesn't bother me at all, Simon. 
<HandiCow> I like it :o) 
<judi> Because they were supposed to be people not a 
    condition 
<tractor> meeither 
<phoenyxx> I hear a Judas Priest song coming 
    on....'FREEWHEEL BURNIN'! :-) 
<Countrybo> lol 
<Mimi> that's what the epileptics...oh, sorry, PWE's say, 
    too 
<judi> We called them people with diabetes 
<Mimi> bah 
<HelloKit> Judi: Yeah but does that make it bad to call 
    someone a blonde or a brunette, or a female or male? 
<judi> I thought it was ridiculous 
<judi> No kidding 
<phoenyxx> one time someone joked with me about what street 
    gang I'd join....think about it :-) 
* HelloKit is a person of female gender. :oP 
<judi> That came from the American diabetes Association 
<Mimi> as long as you don't go around saying 'hello, nice 
    to meet you I'm epileptic' I dont see a problem...semantics 
* HandiCow is vaginally impaired 
<Raven_> hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...Tina? 
<HelloKit> rofl 
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<Countrybo> Welcome to #disabled jrt_1! 
<Mimi> lol 
<HelloKit> How many usually follow the unwritten rules of 
    political correctness? 
<Countrybo> most men are lol 
<jrt_1> I got disconnected:( 
<judi> I guess I am not suppose to be an arthritic ether 
<HelloKit> 'Not I,' said the cat. :o) 
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<Countrybo> only polititians 
<jrt_1> sometimes:) 
<phoenyxx> Carly- I don't. I don't need rules to tell me 
    to accept other people's differences..just common sense and 
    'right' to me. 
<Raven_> mem r? lol 
<Mimi> well, since my cousin who's in a chair jumped down 
    my throat for using the word handicapped, I always say 
    disabled now 
<HandiCow> only gimp wimps follow political correctness 
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<Countrybo> Welcome to #disabled Hillbilly! 
<judi> Wonder who came up with political correctness? 
<Countrybo> i think its silly 
<Hillbilly> hey country 
<HandiCow> Liberals 
<HelloKit> Well, that is one thing that gets to me too, 
    Mimi... for some reason I don't like the word 'handicapped' 
    either. 
<tractor> im tired of heearing the term 
<Mimi> hey hillbilly 
<Countrybo> a rose by any other name would still smell 
    sweet 
<tractor> its to preppy 
<HelloKit> I say, handicaps are for bowlers and golfers. 
<Hillbilly> hi mimi how is that kid 
<phoenyxx> what irritates me are the disability support 
    people I've met that get SO DAMNED SERIOUS about 
    everything. 
<Countrybo> lol true 
<tractor> lol kit 
<judi> My husband calls handicap parking places afflicted 
    spots 
<Mimi> he's great hillbilly thanks :o) 
<HandiCow> lol 
<jrt_1> yeah makes people sound like thay are race horse<g> 
<HelloKit> lol 
<Countrybo> yall need to lighten up what difference does it 
    make what they call us aslong as it aint late for dinner 
    or late on a payment? 
*** HandiCow is now known as Mooooooo
<HelloKit> Judi: Chris just calls them the 'cool spots'. 
    :o) 
<phoenyxx> the thing is though, if someone uses the term 
    handicapped and they really didn't mean anything by it, 
    I'll politely ask them to say disabled instead. 
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<Countrybo> Welcome to #disabled Ray-1! 
<jrt_1> Hi ray:) 
<Countrybo> why? 
<phoenyxx> rather than preach political correctness just for 
    a simple mistake. 
<Countrybo> what difference does it make? 
<judi> Handicapped, disabled, Gimp, who cares? 
<Countrybo> right on judi 
<Ray-1> Hi, all. 
<tractor> really judi 
* BuBbAGump ask what is politically correct for a person 
    to be called who is in a Wheelchair. I have always heard 
    Wheeler was a pretty kewl way 
<Hillbilly> hi ray 
<tractor> hey ray 
<HelloKit> Well, personally, I prefer gimp ;o) 
<judi> Hi Ray 
<phoenyxx> in the future they will call us 'those to cower 
    in fear of' :-) 
<HelloKit> lol 
<Mooooooo> lol 
<judi> Most call me Mom or grandma 
<HelloKit> Do you believe political correctness to be 
    important? 
<jrt_1> but what I find annoying is when you don't have a 
    disablity that can be seen, nobody believes you the first 
    time you tell them 
<Countrybo> the terminology used wont make you un disabled 
    or more disabled it dont mean a thing unl;ess you personal 
    pshyche allows that and tyhats a personal problem then not 
    a worldly one 
<Raven_> no..opinions r important 
<phoenyxx> carly: not me. I mean how does simply using 
    'nicer' and more vague terminology magically make things 
    better? 
* HelloKit agrees. 
<Mooooooo> I equate political correctness with a yeast 
    infection. Both can be cured with a little effort 
<Mimi> I think it's important not to offend people who may 
    be offended 
<Countrybo> lool mooo 
<jrt_1> sometimes 
<HelloKit> lol Daniel 
<phoenyxx> right on the mark countrybo 
<judi> I used to have that problem J. R. T. 
<BuBbAGump> I sometimes use a chair, because i want to 
    build wheelchairs and I want to understand my product 
    better. I like using it, but I do it so I can help the 
    disabled. Does that classify me as a wannabe. No so 
    therefore what is the PC way to call me? 
<jrt_1> cows are bummed:) 
<Countrybo> a wheel chair mechanic lol 
<phoenyxx> uh, I'm for real and have been called a 
    wannabe. 
<BuBbAGump> LOL 
<Countrybo> wheel chair test pilot? 
<Raven_> a wannabe?? 
<tractor> be what? 
<Mooooooo> 'shouldbe' ??? 
<tractor> ????? 
<tractor> could be 
<HelloKit> I like that, Countrybo... lol 
<tractor> ?? 
<Hillbilly> phoenyxx u in chair 
<BuBbAGump> Looks like I got everyone 2 thinkin! 
<Mimi> lol 
<phoenyxx> yes hillbilly 
<Hillbilly> me to 
<Hillbilly> 2 years 
* Countrybo takes bubba aside and says that thing needs 
    more power thats all it needs. 
<phoenyxx> bubbagump- my term for non-disabled using a 
    chair: poser or infiltrator.... 
<phoenyxx> :-) 
* BuBbAGump ask Countrybo what is he talking bout? 
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<Countrybo> Welcome to #Disabled here! 
<Raven_> batteries r slow..i need at least 10 
<judi> phoenyxx, do you ever talk on ICQ? 
* Countrybo wants a 440 hemi dual quad 4 on the floor 
    put in his amigo can we do it bubba? 
* phoenyxx got into a huge tirade about wannabe's a while 
    back :-) 
<jrt_1> Hi here:) 
<phoenyxx> judi: no I haven't but I've heard about it. 
<phoenyxx> mimi: what? 
<phoenyxx> countrybo: you just described one of my dream 
    cars :-) 
<Raven_> they exist pheonnyxx? 
<Countrybo> lol 
* BuBbAGump ask Phoenyxx, they may be true 2 a point, but 
    I am trying to help the disabled for the most part....That 
    does not make me a wannabe, because I am trying to learn 
    and help. Does it? 
<tractor> www.icq.com 4 those interested 
<tractor> iys good 
* Countrybo is from the days of muscle cars 
<HelloKit> Do you think there is a happy medium between 
    politcal correctness and political incorrectness? 
<phoenyxx> Dodge 440 Charger- seen in Mad Max :-) 
<BuBbAGump> I bet......LOL 
<judi> My daughter in law talked to someone last night 
    that worked in public TV shows that sounded like you 
<Raven_> no 
<Countrybo> no you are right bubba and i think i speak 
    for all the disabled here when I say I appreciate you 
    helping us 
<jrt_1> give me mad max's car...yeah... 
<jrt_1> yes:) 
<judi> B. R. B. 
<phoenyxx> bubbagump: pardon the hard line....just that I've 
    gotten way too much flak about using a chair, and my 
    condition is legit. 
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<BuBbAGump> I will work on it. I aminly want to seel 
    chairs. I basically probally know the most about wheelchairs 
    then any kid in the world. You name a chair or a chair 
    comapany, I can tell you aout it or vive versa 
<Countrybo> wow 
* phoenyxx uses a Quickie GPV 
<BuBbAGump> Phoenyxx, Thats ok. Don't judge my book by it's 
    cover and I will do the same 
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<Hillbilly> nitro e&j 
<judi> judi uses a power chair 
<phoenyxx> thanks bubbagump...I am guilty of making the 
    whole 'wannabe' issue into a bigger deal than it really 
    is. 
<tractor> hi search 
<Mimi> <HelloKit> Do you think there is a happy medium 
    between politcal correctness and political incorrectness? 
<Countrybo> Welcome to #Disabled search_un! 
* Countrybo thinks its great bubba ya gotta test them and 
    get a feel on their use to make chairs better for us 
    right? 
<jrt_1> Hi search:) 
<Ray-1> This may be a minority view-- but whatever we call 
    ourselves, it still seems like an uphill climb to get jobs 
    or dates or respect or whatever it is we really want. 
<phoenyxx> I can find a happy medium between the two. 
<phoenyxx> ray-1- hit it right on the head. 
<BuBbAGump> Phoenyxx. That quickie GPV is a take off of 
    the orginal GP by quickie. The only difference is that the 
    foot rest is a sleek v for better manuverability 
<jrt_1> true... 
<Mimi> yes, Carly, I think there is...we can't be overly 
    sensitive about things but also have to take others' 
    feelings into consideration 
<judi> Kit, I think the whole concept is silly 
<tractor> thats right ray amen bro 
* Mooooooo is in love with a gimpette so dont have to 
    worry about dates :o) 
<phoenyxx> bubbagump- definitely very manueverable. 
<HelloKit> :o) 
<Raven_> quickie p300 here 
<Ray-1> stop bragging, Mooooooo. 
<tractor> lol moooooooooooooo 
<jrt_1> :) 
<Mooooooo> /:o) 
<tractor> yeah mooooo im jealous 
<tractor> lol 
<BuBbAGump> Thats right countrybo. I am now trying to learn 
    the things that apra's first go though when they start 
    rehab. Transfers and all the wheelys known to man....LOL 
<judi> But, it seems to be part of today society 
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* Countrybo has a wheel chair and i was afraid to do 
    wheelies lol 
<phoenyxx> again to everyone, sorry about the snide wannabe 
    remark, just that the bs I got on the ng still sticks 
    with me. 
<tractor> ng???? 
<phoenyxx> I do wheelies all the time, it's what got me 
    banned from the community college's Disabled Student Servies 
    office. 
<HelloKit> I don't even have enough arm strength to wheel 
    my chair, let alone do wheelies! 
<BuBbAGump> The quickie p300 is one of the nicest power 
    chairs quickie makes. It is very sllek in style and one 
    of the fastest brand ame power chairs!!! 
<phoenyxx> sorry carly. 
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<Countrybo> Welcome to #Disabled search_un! 
* Countrybo wonders why the darned things cost so much i 
    meand geee all the chair i got was chromed steel tubing 
    lol 
<judi> Political correctness is very much a problem right 
    now, makes one scared to say the wrong thing. 
* Mimi can do good wheelies :o) 
<phoenyxx> quickie does a great job of making a chair look 
    better than just a piece of industrial gear :-) 
<Raven_> heavy.................... 
<Hillbilly> i live in hills and wheelies is the only way 
    i can get around 
<jrt_1> I know how you feel judi... 
<Countrybo> and i am a retired? engineer and know damned 
    well it dont cost 1500 to build a chair with wheels 
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<BuBbAGump> Countrybo....That si another thing I am pushing 
    for. If I learn what I need then I am going to in my 
    spare time make a nice rigid frame affordable chair for 
    those who cannnot afford the brandname!!!!! 
<HelloKit> This question has probably pretty much already 
    been covered, but... 
<HelloKit> Does it bother you when people use PC terms to 
    describe you and/or your disability, or do you prefer that 
    they do? 
<Countrybo> and i think if they wanna charge so much then 
    lets build them out of more composite maintanence free 
    materials 
<judi> Like physically challenged? 
<phoenyxx> ...do you all think that political correctness is 
    what breeds some of the infighting within the disabled 
    community? most flak I've gotten is from other disabled 
    people pissed off that I have a life outside 
<jrt_1> I hate it... 
<phoenyxx> of my condition. 
<Countrybo> and give the powered ones more power 
<phoenyxx> it offends me carly. 
<Countrybo> so they can climb hills 
<Mimi> I think it's ineffecient to call me a 'person with 
    epilepsy' when they can save 3 syllables and say 
    'epileptic' 
<Countrybo> Welcome to #Disabled search_un! 
<HelloKit> Good point, Mimi. 
<Raven_> i feel the www is a perfect place, because we 
    have imput and opinions 
<jrt_1> yes Mimi:) 
<Mimi> it's like, I KNOW I have epilepsy, so who cares 
    what you call it? 
* phoenyxx has found several angelic websites on the www 
    :-) 
<phoenyxx> excellent point Mimi :-) 
<jrt_1> and nobody can judge us until we say we are 
    disabled 
<Raven_> the rig? 
<Countrybo> amen mimi 
<Raven_> ring 
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<BuBbAGump> I would rather people say that boy can't 
    breathe right then to say asthma. When I was young I 
    couldn't say it. It creates a feeling The word does I 
    mean. 
<Hillbilly> hi search 
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<Countrybo> Welcome to #Disabled judi! 
<HelloKit> wb Judi 
<Ray-1> Maybe it's my age, but having cerebral palsy, I 
    wouldn't mind being called a 'CP'. 
<Countrybo> well gee does it make any diff if i say i 
    got bad legs or am a gimp or have md? 
<judi> guess I took a vacation! 
<Mimi> wb judi :o) 
<HelloKit> Mooooooo, would you like your crown back? 
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<judi> Got knocked off line again 
<jrt_1> yes well I know, when I could hardly see, peolpe 
    would look at me strange like I was illiterate or 
    something 
<jrt_1> cause I had to use a maginfing glass too read 
<jrt_1> and get my then 4yo daughter to help me do the 
    shoipping 
<phoenyxx> it might sound weird but I get the most 
    aggravation when I'm trying to get info or help on 
    incontinence (uh, for a friend, yeah that's it!) and the 
    people that know 
<phoenyxx> about it try to gloss over it. 
<Countrybo> lol 
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<Countrybo> Welcome to #disabled PimpC! 
<Mimi> simon :o) 
<tractor> lol phoenyxx 
<Mimi> hey scott :o) 
<phoenyxx> like it goes away if we ignore it....really 
    irritating when I'm looking for products...for a 
    friend....yeah... 
<phoenyxx> :-) 
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<tractor> lol 
<jrt_1> has it all gone quiet or am I lagging? 
<Countrybo> Welcome to #disabled Hillbilly! 
<HelloKit> Would anyone like to add anything else? 
<phoenyxx> I mean, I get shy about it (ok it's me I'm 
    talking about :-) ) but I get more nervous when someone 
    tries to act too casual about it. 
<Mimi> wb hillbilly 
<tractor> quiet 
<Hillbilly> thanks 
<phoenyxx> especially irritating when I've been chided for 
    what I call the products I use for protection. 
<tractor> zzzzzzzzzzz 
<Countrybo> hey phoenix no one likes to admit having inco 
    tinence lol hell i amd healthy in that dept. but have 
    dribbled her and there onmy way to the bahroom because i 
    get there more slowly now lol 
<tractor> ssshhhh 
<Mooooooo> nope 
<Countrybo> ssssh? 
<tractor> be vewy vewy quiet im huntin wabbits 
<HelloKit> lol 
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<Countrybo> Welcome to #disabled BuBbAGump! 
<BuBbAGump> Hate it when that happens 
<BuBbAGump> I think I made a good point b4 I left, but I 
    don't emember it........LOL 
<BuBbAGump> Goodbye 
*** LOG CLOSED: Wed Jan 21 18:38:44 1998